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Plans for Muslim school criticised by Burnley Bishop (From Burnley and Pendle Citizen)
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Plans for Muslim school criticised by Burnley Bishop
8:00pm Wednesday 23rd December 2009
PLANS for a huge faith school in Burnley have been criticised by the town’s Bishop.
The Rt Rev John Goddard said plans for the 1,500-pupil all-girls school on the site of the former Burnley College in Ormerod Road would set back the integration of faiths in the town.
He said he was concerned about the plans, coming as the town continues to get back on track following the 2001 race riots.
“I am concerned about anything that detracts from the growing unity across faiths and race in the town.
“Burnley has made great strides in recent years and a lot of positive things are happening here, including the Building Schools for the Future programme, which is much admired by the Archbishop of Canterbury.
“Anything that detracts and distracts from going forward in integration and having a respectful culture is not good news for Burnley.
“I am not against faith schools in principle but I don’t think this will help Burnley.”
Plans to convert the grade II listed building have been submitted by Birmingham-based Mohiuddin Trust, which said it seeks to promote cohesion by “strengthening inter-community relationships”.
The school would accommodate 1,500 pupils with around 300 boarders at any one time.
The Bishop’s comments come after Pendle MP Gordon Prentice also warned about the dangers of establishing the school in Burnley.
He said: “The last thing we need is single-sex, single faith schools for girls, it pulls against community cohesion.
“It makes me weep to think so much time, energy and effort has gone into the community to get people to mix together. This goes against all public policy.”
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Your Say YourCitizen
snitch, burnley says...
8:43pm Wed 23 Dec 09
Nelsoner-but-moving wrote:Well if you are moving then it is of no interest to you is it? Unless you are moving to Burnley! If the Brierfield Mills was turned down for this reason then why should this scheme go ahead? Work is already under way within the building so there hasn't been any negotiations; it is all systems go. The previous buyers were dismissed to using this building to create residential apartments/homes due to flooding. The plans for the boarding rooms are located on the 1st and 2nd floors; is there good reason why floods will not affect this type of accommodation as oppose to the previous plans? I think not!
oh shut up and let them open it.
Cool Lad, Beautiful Nelson says...
9:07pm Wed 23 Dec 09
Nelsoner-but-moving wrote:Oh shut up and move out of Nelson.
oh shut up and let them open it.
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(not very polite is it?)
snitch, burnley says...
9:19pm Wed 23 Dec 09
Cool Lad wrote:I agree with you cool lad; Yes he/she should shut up and mind their own business especially as they are not affected by this.
Nelsoner-but-moving wrote: oh shut up and let them open it.Oh shut up and move out of Nelson. . (not very polite is it?)
richard a, Burnley says...
10:05pm Wed 23 Dec 09
snitch, burnley says...
10:32pm Wed 23 Dec 09
richard a wrote:Richard a school or college should be solely for educational purposes only. This should include Science, English, Maths, Languages and Religious Education and other specialised Diplomas of the student's choice. It is traditional to learn an education via the curriculum but be nurtured by parents what religion they think their child should follow. That will then give the student a choice in life and not be brainwashed even further. I disagree with Catholic, Muslim, Atheist and Dewish schools. I firmly believe that integration in schools can only encourage each student to share beleifs, have an opinion and celebrate each others festivities. I beleive that is already happening outside schools. So is it really fair to imprison these girls from the outside World, because once that education is over, thay will not get jobs based on their religious beleifs but solely on there grades and the way they present them selves. For some Muslim girls they won't be allowed to enter the employment sector as they will be expected to marry and have children at a very early age.
and what of other non muslim religious schools in the region? should these be closed too? it's a school offering a good education, what's the problem with that?
madari, fence says...
10:55pm Wed 23 Dec 09
For those who didnt know let me tell you :
RELIGION CLOSES THE MIND.
Inter-Rossiter, East Lancs says...
11:46pm Wed 23 Dec 09
richard a wrote:All state-funded faith schools have to teach the national curriculum and are compelled by law to be inclusive and therefore take admissions from outside the faith.
and what of other non muslim religious schools in the region? should these be closed too? it's a school offering a good education, what's the problem with that?
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This school will be wholly for Muslim girls and this goes against all the handwringing we had to endure from the Community Cohesion Review Team and the Cantle Report.
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The govt should be stepping in and putting a stop to this. After all, it was they who set up the Home Office reviews on Community Cohesion and designed the social engineering behind BSF programme.
FREDF2009, Burnley says...
12:48am Thu 24 Dec 09
The Brierfield Mills have been bought by Islamic Relief. They have secured the funding required to buy the site and are currently in the process of finalising the purchase with the owners and Pendle Council. There is talk that they will proceed with an application for business units and a small school.
snitch, burnley says...
1:41am Thu 24 Dec 09
DaveBurnley, Burnley says...
8:08am Thu 24 Dec 09
madari wrote:Very true madari, so many wars have been fought, so many have died in the name of religion.
Madari the snake charmer says:
For those who didnt know let me tell you :
RELIGION CLOSES THE MIND.
Mike Costa, Blackburn says...
9:01am Thu 24 Dec 09
richard a wrote:Mike Costa says:
and what of other non muslim religious schools in the region? should these be closed too? it's a school offering a good education, what's the problem with that?
Yep. Close them all. As Madari and Daveburnley say religion is the root cause of so many wars.
The idea of having these places of indoctrination is totally at odds with the attempts being made to integrate the various sections of our society. As all other religions will be barred from attending these Academies (unlike Cof E schools which allows a percentage of followers of other faiths to attend!) they become totally devisive.
If people are really that keen to be taught solely about an archaic, repressive and brutal religion, without allowing other religious beliefs to be taught (as laid down in the National Curriculum), they should find soewhere else other than this country to live.
One rule for the Muslims and another rule for the rest of us yet again
Excluded, Darwen says...
9:04am Thu 24 Dec 09
Schools which select on the basis of faith are divisive. So there should be none of them - Muslim, Jewish or Christian.
I'm sure the Bishop is in negotiations with the Council to convert all Church of England schools into community schools. Otherwise he is just a great big hypocrite.
martin smith, Burnley says...
9:22am Thu 24 Dec 09
midas, burnley says...
9:32am Thu 24 Dec 09
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If it was a state school then your arguments would have some validity but what you are effectively arguing is "your muslim and therefore you cant choose how to educate your children". If this was a private Catholic (mainly for whites) school would there be such a fuss?
DaveBurnley, Burnley says...
9:36am Thu 24 Dec 09
I don't know where you've got this 'fact' from but the Church school I used to work at certainly didn't ask for a letter from the parish priest. I can only assume you have heard of one school doing it and have decided that they all do it.
The C of E school I was involved with was about 40% Asian when I was there, we were able to teach religion in a sympathetic way without causing any problems.
Mike Costa, Blackburn says...
9:43am Thu 24 Dec 09
midas wrote:Mike Costa says:
Is this going to be a private school, with parents paying the fees? no money from the government? If so then its a private business and will stand or fall on economic principles. 1500 children in a fee paying school will make it one of the biggest private schools in the Country. . If it was a state school then your arguments would have some validity but what you are effectively arguing is "your muslim and therefore you cant choose how to educate your children". If this was a private Catholic (mainly for whites) school would there be such a fuss?
Your argument is fine as far as it goes. However, having the money to pay for a different 'type' of education doesn't make it okay. Religious indoctrination is a very dangerous path to go down. If the parents want their children to receive religious education then they can go to the mosques each night, which already happens. There is no need for a seperate day school. Therefore, the setting up of them is, rightly or wrongly, perceived as being somewhat sinister. Why do they need them? They only serve to keep divisions between cultures alive, and I thought the Muslim community were keen to integrate. Perhaps not as keen as they would like us to believe
England Uber Alles, Burnley says...
11:12am Thu 24 Dec 09
It's not the single faith school that is the problem as I see it, it's when these pupils finish school and return to their inward looking communities never or hardly mixing with the wider society,therefore becoming even more islolated. This it seems would suit some muslims, by not wanting their young females to become "affected" by western values and freedoms.
Isolation only leads to mistrust and suspicion.
Inter-Rossiter, East Lancs says...
12:40pm Thu 24 Dec 09
martin smith wrote:I've never heard such nonsense.
I think that it is a bit rich this criticism coming from a bishop. The faith schools in East Lancashire are not exactly doing their bit for community cohesion when they insist on a letter from a parish priest to enrol at a church school. How many aisian pupils and non CE or non RC pupils does each church school take?
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BTW: Martin Smith - are you the LibDem councillor who goes by the same name?
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If so, you should provide some evidence or keep your gob shut. Oh, and if you are indeed the councillor - well, it least we all know which side of the debate you're on.
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I would have thought your party was in favour of community cohesion or does this only apply when it's the indigenous people who have to bend over backwards?
midas, burnley says...
12:42pm Thu 24 Dec 09
.
FREDF2009, Burnley says...
12:57pm Thu 24 Dec 09
The Brierfield Mills have been bought by Islamic Relief. They have secured the funding required to buy the site and are currently in the process of finalising the purchase with the owners and Pendle Council. There is talk that they will proceed with an application for business units and a small school.
karolgadge, Oswaldtwistle says...
1:59pm Thu 24 Dec 09
World War I (50 million dead); World War 2 (more than 80 million at a conservative estimate); Korean War; Vietnam War' ; the purges of Lenin and Stalin ; Ukrainian famine, destruction of the Kulaks, forced farming collectivisation (perhaps another 30 million and counting); and, not forgetting the Cultural Revolution of Mao Zhe Dong and the 'Great Leap Forward' (50 million casualties?).
I don't recall Lenin, Stalin or Mao parading intolerance and lack of respect because they were attracted to belief in a higher power; their murderous intentions were largely nurtured by a determination to destroy religion once and for all.
BacupBoy, Bacup says...
2:38pm Thu 24 Dec 09
DaveBurnley wrote:But so many more have died in societies that have tried to eliminate religion - just look at Stalin's Russia and Mao's China.
madari wrote: Madari the snake charmer says: For those who didnt know let me tell you : RELIGION CLOSES THE MIND.Very true madari, so many wars have been fought, so many have died in the name of religion.
midas, burnley says...
3:45pm Thu 24 Dec 09
Inter-Rossiter wrote:Ripley St. Thomas school in Lancaster is one where, due to the over application for places, priority is given to those families that attend at Church. This has to be confirmed both in interview with the head teacher and supported by a letter from the Church.
martin smith wrote: I think that it is a bit rich this criticism coming from a bishop. The faith schools in East Lancashire are not exactly doing their bit for community cohesion when they insist on a letter from a parish priest to enrol at a church school. How many aisian pupils and non CE or non RC pupils does each church school take?I've never heard such nonsense. . BTW: Martin Smith - are you the LibDem councillor who goes by the same name? . If so, you should provide some evidence or keep your gob shut. Oh, and if you are indeed the councillor - well, it least we all know which side of the debate you're on. . I would have thought your party was in favour of community cohesion or does this only apply when it's the indigenous people who have to bend over backwards?
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I know a number of people who go to Church purely to get their faces known by the vicar so he will support their application.
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To pretend the situation is otherwise is just to support the rascist arguement that "the christians" don't so that.
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Remember you are only indigenous through a stroke of fortune.
Inter-Rossiter, East Lancs says...
4:42pm Thu 24 Dec 09
However, the law says that state-funded faith schools have to be open to all and that a percentage of those pupils attending the schools should be from outside the faith.
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Anyway, let's get things straight here. Not one of you, who are championing this all-girl Islamic school, has gone on to explain how such a school will help with so-called community cohesion and integration.
At the end of the day, as you well know, it will only increase segregation.
Maybe that's what you want, but on your own terms, just like its always been.
richard a, Burnley says...
8:46pm Thu 24 Dec 09
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The 300 boarders are surely for those that do not live within the area. For those of you who cannot do the maths, that means 1200 will not be boarding and will be 'integrating' with society.
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Please think and do some research before you speak.
Inter-Rossiter, East Lancs says...
9:14pm Thu 24 Dec 09
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It's an underhand tactic used to silence debate. Yep, tis no wonder the Stazi became redundant and went the same way as the dinosaurs when you have the PC Brigade outdoing them by goose-stepping on anyone who dares to disagree.
richard a, Burnley says...
2:44pm Fri 25 Dec 09
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My previous comment was based purely on what I have had read, there are several good points made but also many based purely on misconceptions.
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Inter-rossiter, I have no problem for anyone disagreeing, as long as the right reasons are present. Besides, given the state of secondary schools in Burnley this is a well needed investment in the town.
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No I'm not a 'know it all', I just happen to be well educated and aware of religious and social beliefs.
DaveBurnley, Burnley says...
5:11pm Fri 25 Dec 09
richard a wrote:richard a, it's you who seems to have difficulty in research and speaking.
I truly cannot believe how ignorant some people are, and racist for that matter. If you are going to comment on the muslim faith I urge you to speak what you truly know and what you've heard or have been led to believe. The comments only prove our state education does not work, ignorance and stupidity seems an ever increasing trend.
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The 300 boarders are surely for those that do not live within the area. For those of you who cannot do the maths, that means 1200 will not be boarding and will be 'integrating' with society.
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Please think and do some research before you speak.
These 1200 non boarders who you claim "will be 'integrating' with society"
just where will they integrate? will they meet people from all walks of life? No, they will be inside their introspective little enclave where they will continue to be indoctrinated in their own beliefs.
Why do you stand up for people who try to segregate our society? We need more openness, not these insular little groups who try to create a pressure group within our country which has no wish to join into our society.
fkhan, burnley says...
12:21am Sun 27 Dec 09
richard a, Burnley says...
12:46pm Sun 27 Dec 09
fkhan wrote:I'm glad there's someone else aware of the situation.
The asian community and in particular the muslim community (as the forum appears to be target) is more than willing and is integrating within the mainstream populas. Our forefathers did this when they were invited to this country and were made to live in slump like conditions doing low paid work. Muslims contributes billions to the UK economy, some of the richest people in the UK are of an muslim background, there are muslims playing sport at a high level, muslims hold some positions at the highests levels as scientists, intellectuals, doctors, lawyers, accountants to name a few. Those who say muslims aren't contributing to community cohesion and the wider community are truly misguided.
passingfootball, Blackburn says...
11:54pm Sun 27 Dec 09
Spare us your crocodile tears dear... it may fool some but not all, but its no surprise, making a big fuss over nothing. Muslim community should take no notice of this guy, and the arguement he uses are a smokescreen.
RAyzer, BURNLEY says...
9:48am Mon 28 Dec 09
DaveBurnley, Burnley says...
1:04pm Mon 28 Dec 09
That's an irrelevant argument, there are Jewish, Chinese, African and many other nations who could make the same claim.
By the same argument you could say that there are Moslem murderers, thieves and criminals.
The real argument seems to be that Moslems are trying to set up a segregated school system, this isn't the way to achieve community cohesion unless you only want to achieve it in a small subgroup of the population.
Inter-Rossiter, East Lancs says...
2:25pm Mon 28 Dec 09
The supporters of this Islamic school haven't half come out with some utter nonsense.
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It appears they wish to encourage segregation while cheerleading a select few.
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Anyone who knows anything about Muslim community, here in East Lancs, will agree that they live mostly in insular communities and this is fully encourage by their politicians who guard their political dynasties like gold.
However, to state such a thing is tantamount to racism in the minds of the political correct stormtroopers.
RAyzer, BURNLEY says...
2:45pm Mon 28 Dec 09
joej, burnley says...
6:36pm Mon 28 Dec 09
YOU CAN MAKE YOUR OBJETIONS OR COMMENTS IN ONE OF 3 WAYS .
IN WRITING OR BY EMAIL OR ONLINE .
APPLICATION NO APP/2009/0741
ifihadthewingsofaneagle, home says...
5:21am Tue 29 Dec 09
One rule for one and another rule for Muslims.
Can you imagine the uproar if plans were announced to open an all boys Christian School. It wouldn't go ahead.
Not all Muslims are terrorists...... But all terrorists are Muslims... and bringing these kids up in a sheltered, narrow-minded environment will only make this worse.
How can you call for integration and then agree with opening this school.
ALL OF YOU DO-GOODERS ARE SPOILING BRITAIN! GIVE YOUR HEADS A WOBBLE!!!!
fkhan, burnley says...
3:18pm Tue 29 Dec 09
ifihadthewingsofaneaWhich half of dumb and dumber are you?
gle wrote:
Come on folks, get a grip. One rule for one and another rule for Muslims. Can you imagine the uproar if plans were announced to open an all boys Christian School. It wouldn't go ahead. Not all Muslims are terrorists...... But all terrorists are Muslims... and bringing these kids up in a sheltered, narrow-minded environment will only make this worse. How can you call for integration and then agree with opening this school. ALL OF YOU DO-GOODERS ARE SPOILING BRITAIN! GIVE YOUR HEADS A WOBBLE!!!!
I really don’t want to waste my time responding to your illiterate, disillusion, totally unfounded and without logic comments. Clearly you are a prime example of someone who has been through the state education system (taught in some parts of the UK) or, then again, I’d be amazed if you even finished school.
DaveBurnley, Burnley says...
9:21am Wed 30 Dec 09
fkhan wrote:When you have to resort to insulting a fellow poster, that's a pretty good sign that you've lost the argument.
ifihadthewingsofaneaWhich half of dumb and dumber are you?
gle wrote:
Come on folks, get a grip. One rule for one and another rule for Muslims. Can you imagine the uproar if plans were announced to open an all boys Christian School. It wouldn't go ahead. Not all Muslims are terrorists...... But all terrorists are Muslims... and bringing these kids up in a sheltered, narrow-minded environment will only make this worse. How can you call for integration and then agree with opening this school. ALL OF YOU DO-GOODERS ARE SPOILING BRITAIN! GIVE YOUR HEADS A WOBBLE!!!!
I really don’t want to waste my time responding to your illiterate, disillusion, totally unfounded and without logic comments. Clearly you are a prime example of someone who has been through the state education system (taught in some parts of the UK) or, then again, I’d be amazed if you even finished school.
Why not admit it fkhan, this whole idea is diversive and will do nothing for community cohesion.
midas, burnley says...
9:43am Wed 30 Dec 09
ifihadthewingsofaneaWhat? do you mean a school like Stoneyhurst (for example)? though I accept that Stoneyhurst has, in the last few years, gone co-ed. Would you be objecting so vociferously if it were plans for a private Convant School?
gle wrote:
Come on folks, get a grip. One rule for one and another rule for Muslims. Can you imagine the uproar if plans were announced to open an all boys Christian School. It wouldn't go ahead. Not all Muslims are terrorists...... But all terrorists are Muslims... and bringing these kids up in a sheltered, narrow-minded environment will only make this worse. How can you call for integration and then agree with opening this school. ALL OF YOU DO-GOODERS ARE SPOILING BRITAIN! GIVE YOUR HEADS A WOBBLE!!!!
MIKEOXLONGER, Real World says...
8:36pm Fri 1 Jan 10
Nelsoner-but-moving wrote:Have you moved yet? I'll give you a hand if you like?
oh shut up and let them open it.
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Nelsoner-but-moving, Nelson says...
8:02pm Wed 23 Dec 09